Badflower Tour Delay, Vocal Techniques, New Lamb of God, & Trivia
Jason Ziolo
. Welcome everybody. It is season two, episode six of Rock Fan Radio. It is a Sunday night, different night for us, but we said what the hell we wanted to do a podcast, and specifically, Reid really wanted to talk about the Lamb of God album that came out on Friday. So we threw together an episode, I put some trivia together, and we're gonna go through some trivia stuff, have some fun, and talk about lot of modern and some not so modern bands. Huh?
I've got Steve, I've Dave, I've got Reed, and I have Parker. Say hello, guys.
Steve
What up?
Dave Cravotta
Hello, guys.
Reed
Hey!
Parker
Hello?
Jason Ziolo
So we.
Dave Cravotta
Hello adoring fans.
Reed
For those
of you not watching on YouTube, Parker's beard is just A plus tonight, A plus.
Steve
A plus.
Parker
Hell yeah.
Jason Ziolo
Well, you don't like my beard too, do Jeez.
Parker
you
Reed
Also
for you not watching, Jason now has holes in his ears.
Jason Ziolo
It's true. ⁓ Anyways, we shall move on. So I'm gonna go right in, I'm gonna ask a trivia question. I've got eight trivia questions lined up for tonight. What I'm gonna do is actually, we're probably gonna have to cut this. Are you guys all on the trivia board? So, and are logged in and waiting? Probably not.
Parker
you
Steve
Yeah. Yep.
Dave Cravotta
let me do that wordpress spotify
Jason Ziolo
No, no, it's in
another email. Just go to rockfanradio.com slash trivia.
Dave Cravotta
wait wait. yes. Copy.
Hmm
Jason Ziolo
And also while we're sitting here taking a break, when we're done here, don't forget to leave your app open until everything says it's done completing uploading, because that screwed me last week. Luckily, I worked with Matt and I was able to recover it. But that's one of the reasons I was really having so many problems.
Dave Cravotta
Copy.
What's the key?
Jason Ziolo
[why are you reding this]
Dave Cravotta
Like geese, but not.
Reed
a lot less boring a lot more
Jason Ziolo
and they can't fly.
Steve
I could really go for some moose soup right now.
Jason Ziolo
Is that a thing?
Steve
Yeah, it's delicious. It's so fucking good.
Dave Cravotta
What is scoreboard only? Do I do that?
Jason Ziolo
No,
you do not want scoreboard only.
Reed
I may have.
Dave Cravotta
waiting for the admin to start the session. Boom.
Jason Ziolo
All right, cool. All right, so I'm gonna go back to it now. So here we are, we have a scoreboard set up for our Trivia system. This is the first time we're using this. know, at any time also, we do video tape this stuff and you can watch the video if you're watching this on YouTube or Spotify or some different platforms, but we're totally audio only compatible too as a podcast. we're enough, you're not really missing much here on video.
except for a silly scoreboard where we're gonna make fun of each other, because Reed can't communicate the questions correct. So we're gonna go and we're gonna see if we can actually make this work. So gentlemen, I am going to here, I'm going to launch a new, I'm gonna launch a new question. We give you a little background, ask the question, you'll have a chance to answer, you're gonna answer on your screens privately, and then I get to see all the answers and you guys do not get to see what you put.
And I get to select you and ask you to defend the answers and make fun of you when you're completely wrong and don't know the answer. Yeah. All right. So here we go. I have to figure out how to how to find the right question I was going to ask. Oh, there it is. OK. So I should be able to do this now. And I'm going to go and I'll edit this out so it sounds better.
Dave Cravotta
Yes.
Steve
So, this is...
Reed
This sounds amazing.
Dave Cravotta
Yes, outstanding.
Parker
This
is incredible. I love this new segment.
Jason Ziolo
So I'm gonna go ahead and start the session. We should all see our screens move now.
Nope, not yet, I haven't chosen the question yet. I'm going to ask the question. But before I do, I'm gonna give us a little bit of background. Damn it, I should have organized this better.
Dave Cravotta
can edit all this. You're good.
Jason Ziolo
And that shows me that there's only three players. So I'm missing one of you guys.
Reed
think you need to kick, because I clicked scoreboard only and I can't re-log in. Are you able to kick me out?
Jason Ziolo
can kick us all out. No, at the bottom it says use different key at the bottom. Start over. That's basically start over.
Reed
No, because now that key that Moose key doesn't work. God, I fucked it all up. Hang on. Let me just
Jason Ziolo
You fucked it up, we're off
to start over. You're all gonna get bounced and we're gonna start over.
Reed
⁓ Jesus Christ, Reed. This is why we don't podcast on Sundays.
Jason Ziolo
Hehehehe
Steve
invalid key.
Jason Ziolo
Gage. G-A-U-G-E.
Gage.
Steve
What?
Parker
Rears are about to be in a couple months.
Reed
So just click on scoreboard only.
Steve
What is it?
Jason Ziolo
I will kill
you, Eden. Scoreboard's my view that I can cast over.
Reed
Gage, Steve. G-A-U-G-E. Gage.
Jason Ziolo
Gage.
Parker
like Jason's ears soon. Say it again, because no one laughed the first time. ⁓
Reed
⁓
Jason Ziolo
Yeah.
Reed
I didn't hear it the first time. That's good.
Parker
Hahaha
Jason Ziolo
I deserve all of it.
Steve
G-A-U-G-E.
Jason Ziolo
Yep. Did ask for your name after that?
Steve
Yeah, I'm there now.
Jason Ziolo
Okay, so I'm gonna hit start session. should see your screen maybe do something, maybe not.
Reed
And then like.
Parker
Is Dave still
with us? No, they're in spirit.
Reed
Bye!
Dave Cravotta
We're getting some nasty weather in Indy so I wonder if...
Anyhow, I'm back. Yes, sorry.
Reed
why we can't have nice things.
Jason Ziolo
You're back with us.
Steve
Alright.
Parker
That's
Jason Ziolo
No.
Parker
why
we have to to Thursdays. There's never any bad weather on Thursdays.
Reed
Right?
Come on, Iowa. Man. Yeah, gauge.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah, it will let ⁓ my key is invalid now as well
Parker
I just
changed. ⁓
Jason Ziolo
Okay guys, we're gonna go now, okay? We're back
in.
Parker
This is a disaster. I love it.
Reed
Yeah is,
Absolute dumpster fire.
Jason Ziolo
Trivia question number one. This British rock band has always been obsessed with space. It runs through their entire catalog from album titles to lyrics to stage productions that look like a NASA mission control crossed with a stadium concert. So when it came time to announce their 10th studio album last Friday, they didn't put out a press release. They didn't post on social media first. Instead, they sent a 30 tablet 33 kilometers into space
into the atmosphere, what they call the edge of space. And they premiered their new music video before anyone on the ground had heard a single note, they played it for space. The album itself is pulled straight from a real moment in scientific history and when 1977 an astronomer heard a 72 second radio burst from space, circled it out on a printout and wrote one word next to it. And that one word is now the new title of their new record.
Reed
too easy.
Jason Ziolo
Too easy? All right, well give it to me. Don't say it, write it.
Dave Cravotta
I I know this one.
Steve
I have no idea.
Reed
Locked in.
Jason Ziolo
Locked in, one of five players have answered. What about the other four of you?
Parker
I don't know.
Jason Ziolo
Then make a guess. Come on, album came out Friday, space themed. Our album got announced on Friday. We were talking about it on Friday.
Parker
you
Yeah.
Okay.
Reed
Okay, let me Google that real quick.
Steve
Yeah, no shit. I definitely got this one wrong.
Jason Ziolo
Steve is locked
Reed
Mm-hmm.
Jason Ziolo
in. ⁓ Dave found a way to work around the system.
Reed
Mm-hmm.
Dave Cravotta
The key isn't working. Not for me.
Reed
It's a different key.
G-A-U-G-E.
Hmm, good to know.
Dave Cravotta
yes, now we're onto something.
Reed
Well, this is why we don't podcast on Sundays guys. This has been a real train wreck.
Jason Ziolo
we got David, Steve's in twice. We got Parker, we've got Reed once in. My technology is just working fucking great here, isn't it? Look at the head scoreboard.
Reed
Yeah
Jason Ziolo
All right,
Dave Cravotta
I didn't get it right.
Jason Ziolo
we are ditching this completely and we're just gonna talk about it. Because this is stupid and it's just slowing us down.
Reed
I Muse released a new album on Friday.
Steve
Hahahaha!
Jason Ziolo
Okay, well the answer is obviously Muse, okay? They're releasing a new album. They brought out the new song on Friday. I was a little underwhelmed by it. It's gotta be the starting track of the new album. It starts out with like a whole like big organ intro, delays it out, brings in kind of a big electric beat and then puts a big drop in the middle and right when it starts to get interesting, it starts to end.
And it's gotta be the starter track, right? Jen, you guys listen to it.
Steve
No.
Reed
Yeah, I
didn't look I didn't love it. But they what was the it made me think of the first release they did? Maybe not last maybe oh No from the really trippy Jesus Christ, let's just yeah, I'll just see you guys Thursday
Jason Ziolo
No.
Madness. No, damn.
why we don't do this on Sundays.
Parker
you
Jason Ziolo
He just left, so... ⁓
Reed
Origin to symmetry!
Origin—no, not origin. What was the one—oh god, hang on.
Jason Ziolo
Only there is like a way you could find this out. The new album's coming out June 26th, which is awesome because that's my birthday weekend. And it's one of my favorite bands. The song is called The Wow Signal, which is kind of stupid. So like on the printout when he saw the markings, he circled it and put wow around it. So they call it The Wow Signal. And that's what it's been called over time. But this really did happen in 1977. There was a signal that no one could decode.
Reed
That's what I'm doing.
Dave Cravotta
wow.
Reed
second law.
Steve
heard about that Wow signal yeah
Jason Ziolo
looked legit right in the frequencies. They said if we were to ever hear from outer space from another civilization, it's likely to be this frequency and it hit all the buttons. And it still kind of goes unexplained about what happened. But scientifically, I guess, and I'm gonna say a bunch of crap I don't know anything about, the signals fit the profile of cold hydrogen clouds, possibly excited by a magnetar, a type of a neutron star.
that wasn't synthesized until 1992. So they didn't really know of these stuff in 1992. So the stuff in 1972 was foreign to them and we kind of figured it out. But here we are and Muse is gonna write a whole album about it, which is fun because they kind of do operatic big symphony kind of stuff, make a big grand story. And it sounds like a really cool premise for a Steven Spielberg movie, which is basically like what a Muse album is.
Reed
So I remember when they released the first track off of the second law and I was like, this is not that great. But then the album as a whole was obviously totally wildly awesome. they're masters of this shit though. You know what I'm saying? Like they've been doing this for a long time.
They're really good at releasing things and kind of making people think and question what they're doing. And then they release something that's totally awesome. And they also seem to produce lately, like all of their albums are produced for their live show, right? I feel like Bellamy works backwards. Like how many, what cool stuff can I do in an arena? And then let's make music against aliens popping out of the stage. You know what I'm saying? Like their live show is so good that, you know, they kind of work backwards, I feel like.
Jason Ziolo
Yeah.
Dave Cravotta
Hmm.
Steve
Mmm.
Jason Ziolo
And
they do it.
Steve
Are they one of those bands where you see them live and they'll...
Jason Ziolo
Sometimes you see a band and you're like, elevated
what a stage show is. Muse did that for me back in like 2010, it's the first time I saw them. Cause you're like, I've never seen bands do anything like this. And even the last time they came in town, they played in the round. And I remember, I talked about this last season on the podcast, it's still burned in my memory. They had basically these like, silhouettes that were not silhouettes, do you call it? Marionettes, Marionettes. ⁓ Figures above them, these hands.
Dave Cravotta
Mm.
Jason Ziolo
you know, acting like they're the Marionettes and they this like holographic display to make it look, it was like nothing I'd ever seen before in a rock show and it's anywhere, ever, except for maybe the sphere. It was that level and it way before the sphere was.
Reed
Muse is one of those bands that like, even if you don't love their music, they are absolutely worth the price of admission to check them out.
Steve
That's cool.
Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
And they're gonna span everything. They're gonna play slower, they're gonna sit down at a piano and play a beautiful something or another on the piano, then he's gonna pick up his guitar and throw down harder than most bands can. He's got an amazing voice, the bass player's phenomenal. The drummer knows how to fit, he's really minimal, but he knows his place in the band. I could talk about Muse all day, let's not.
Dave Cravotta
You
Steve
Question number two.
Jason Ziolo
What else
we got? Dave, you got some bad flower, I think.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah, how long you got? ⁓ So I did a little bit of digging into this. So Josh Katz, lead singer of Bad Flower. Bad Flower seems to be a bit of a polarizing band. First time I ever heard about them. I was actually up in Chicago going, we were getting ready to go to see Sleep Token. Reed, you, me, Jason and Brooke, we were all together. And Jason brought up Bad Flower and said, Dave, you should check out Bad Flower and Reed, you were like, yeah, if you want to kill yourself.
Jason Ziolo
Yeah.
Steve
you
Jason Ziolo
you
Parker
Hahaha
Dave Cravotta
I'm ooh, okay, I'm intrigued. I like tormented art. And Jason, you went on to tell me about how you wanted to go to an upcoming show and nobody wanted to go with you. And Reeve was like, because nobody hates themselves that much. was very much like, these guys sound very depressing. so they are, they are. And I'll definitely, like to get into that a little bit. But anyhow, a couple of releases later, because that was two years ago, I think.
Jason Ziolo
They're one of my very favorites, tortured artists, man. I'm with you.
Dave Cravotta
they recently Josh cast started having a lot of lead singer started having issues on tour with his voice it was really unpredictable he couldn't hit higher notes he couldn't hit lower notes. It was causing a lot of mental stress for him in the middle of the show earlier this month he said you know I can't do this the whole thing is canceled and walked off the set and then the band came back and said no no tours back on we're gonna go ahead and perform and then a little bit after that they said.
Jason Ziolo
So mid-set
he was like, I am done, I can't handle this, I'm going home.
Dave Cravotta
that is
correct they do not have a schedule show until early may at a festival I'm so what that says to me is that he has taken I'm guessing the band or specifically cats is taken about six weeks six eight weeks off which is a great time for him to get right he said in a video that was posted he was diagnosed with what's called muscle tension dysphonia which basically just funny is difficulty with your voice muscle tension means you have way too much tension going on in your throat in your voice box we also call your larynx
Jason Ziolo
Dave, you have experience with this. Give us your creds. You actually are certified to talk about this stuff.
Dave Cravotta
What happens is you get a lot of... Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, I am. So I'm a speech language pathologist. If you Google what should Josh Katz do next to help with his voice problems, it will say he should go to a speech language pathologist or specifically someone who is trained in voice. I work with people with MTD every week, maybe not singers to his level, but I've worked with vocal coaches, choir instructors, people who are classically trained rock singers. I've seen all kinds of voice issues and his is not unusual.
What's unusual is that he gets up in front of thousands of people pretty much every night and tries to perform and his body isn't letting him do the things that he wants to do. Now in the video that he posted he said, know it's his muscle tension dysphonia, but that's not it. It's got to be something else and he's probably right. MTD is not what we call an exclusionary diagnosis, meaning that's the only thing that's going on. There's a good chance something else is going on and given his mental health history, it's pretty easy to connect the dots and say,
Look man, you have a lot of stress that you're dealing with and your anxiety is off the charts and that is ground zero for all that muscle tension to happen. He's probably been able to sing the way he's wanted to sing for years and now all of a sudden his body won't do what it usually does. Much like a professional athlete just out of nowhere is like, why can't I do this anymore? Because you have some kind of physical issue that's going on and when that happens all those other kinds of things start to creep in doubt.
Jason Ziolo
It's like what do they call it,
a Rune Goldberg machine? It's like one thing affects the other, which affects the other, which affects the other.
Dave Cravotta
Absolutely.
Yeah, and that's exactly how your body works. If any of you have ever had like a knee injury or a hip issue or a foot issue and you go to see a professional, they can very easily say, well, yeah, the problem is in this joint. But what's actually happening is it's you're making it worse by doing this other thing with this other joint. So I had to go to PT for my knee and they said, we're going to start with your hips. And I'm like, what? But the problem's in my knee. And they're like, right, because weakness in your hips can have downstream effects on your knee. And this is kind of similar.
Jason Ziolo
Yep.
Dave Cravotta
This is a downstream effect, I think, of years of stress, anxiety, depression, sort of stuff. And it's manifesting in this vocal issue that probably just started as a little something, a little twinge, a little change in his voice at one point, but then all that. And then he couldn't hit the note that he usually hits and boom, that feeling, that anxiety that happens as a result is overwhelming. If you've ever been speaking in front of a group and all of sudden your voice cracks or something, like boom, you instantly feel super self-conscious and like, oh shit, I don't want that to happen again. What was that?
and for him it keeps happening. he will hopefully go get voice therapy to do a couple of things. I think the big thing will be reliability. Have a good vocal warm-up, know exactly what you're doing, same routine every time. So when you go on stage, everything is the same. But even before that, what we do with muscle tension dysphonia is we got to get the throat to chill out. There's too much stress in there, we got to relax everything. What happens is vocal cords come together, they kind of zip and unzip and that's how your voice happens. But you got to have the breath.
from your diaphragm basically to be the gas pedal and push your voice out. What can happen is if you strain in your throat, all these extra tissues in your voice box, they kind of cover it all up and that's what causes all that unreliability and instability. So he would do exercises that would relax the throat basically and then learn how to sing without using so much strain in his neck, which is gonna be hard because that's part of his performance. That's what rock people do is that's how you get intense is all that kind of strain.
Jason Ziolo
Yup.
Dave Cravotta
What he will eventually be able to do is still provide that intensity, but have it come from his breath, from his diaphragm, and not so much from his voice box. It'll take some time. That's like a six to eight week program.
Jason Ziolo
So how does,
that was my question. that's this, he's probably got six to eight weeks out of them. That's what you typically would see.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah.
That's that. Yeah. When I set up what are called plans of care for any of my voice patients, especially this kind of diagnosis, we're looking at at least two months. Sometimes it's longer. Sometimes it's shorter. I think with somebody who's going to go up on stage and perform in front of people, you kind of want to start really small, like just perform in front of a mirror. Just perform for your bandmates. Just perform for your mom. Something like that. And then try to build up from there before you and to go to a festival. Man, is your first show. That's...
Reed
You
Dave Cravotta
Hope maybe he can do some little side gigs at open mic night somewhere because to go out in front of tens of thousands of people that first night he has to be like stone-cold locked in reliable I know exactly what's gonna happen. That's gonna be really hard for him
Jason Ziolo
It's gotta
be, I can see how you can get that frustrated by it, especially when you're on stage. And he's got kind of that relationship with people too, his fans where it's real close connected. It's almost that Caleb Shomo, bear tooth thing he's got going where it's about, hey, we're getting through life together, not just through music, but by communicating with each other. And the fans are, I've been, I'm on a couple groups and they're up on arms, not up and that's the wrong way putting it. are.
Reed
I'm feeling anxiety just you talking about that.
Steve
Raise.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
horribly upset about this and the empathy that's pouring out and all this and it's really interesting to watch.
Dave Cravotta
He's one of these talented vocalists that can put feelings that people are having to words and to music. And when somebody does that for you, you feel heard. And then when that person isn't doing that anymore, you don't feel as heard. And that can be really emotional and challenging for folks. Especially if you're counting on seeing this guy. Because he is Bad Flower. I really don't know any of the other people in the band. But I don't know that they would exist in the way that they do if he wasn't doing what he's
Jason Ziolo
You know, that's
a different discussion I'm not prepared to talk about. I always wondered that too. Is he, he's the piece, the cover of all the albums. He's the, he, you sometimes it's just his face on there. of I think the past two out of three have been just his face. And I digress, go ahead.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah.
Well,
just as you tied it to Beartooth, I think Caleb Schomo's the same. I think he writes and records everything for Beartooth, and then his band performs for him. I don't think Bad Flower does quite the same thing, but it's gonna be super challenging for him. Man, and I think Jason just had an aspiration event. I also deal with those, so if you need to come see me for a scope, I got you, brother.
Jason Ziolo
Thank
Parker
you
Jason Ziolo
HMMM... HAHAHAHA!
Parker
You
Dave Cravotta
it.
Reed
Jesus. Sunday.
Jason Ziolo
I could
not hold that one.
Dave Cravotta
This is my job right here in the last six, seven minutes.
Reed
ask you totally random questions since we're diving into your expertise.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah, please, fire away.
Reed
I, and actually, Jason, I think you and I have had this conversation, but I don't understand how Jared Leto can still be performing. Like, he puts so much strain on, it's like he's screaming when he's performing. I don't understand how he could have a voice.
Jason Ziolo
Reed, give us a little background about Jared Leto. Isn't he an actor? Why do we care about his voice?
Reed
So he was a heartthrob. Yes, he was a
beautiful heartthrob actor back in the day. All of our wives probably still crush on him because he's gorgeous. He also starred in one of the worst movies ever reviewed in Tron Errat. But on the side gig, he's got, actually I think he puts his band before his acting.
Jason Ziolo
Was it worse than him as
the Joker in Suicide Squad? Because that was pretty awful.
Parker
Yeah, let's not forget about
the worst Joker ever,
Jason Ziolo
Yeah,
Reed
Well,
Jason Ziolo
exactly.
Reed
but at least that movie made money in trying to not, so I guess you can argue it both ways. Jared Leto's The Leads.
Dave Cravotta
He was also in Fight Club.
I felt like destroying something beautiful. He destroyed Jared Leto.
Reed
That was Jared Leto? Whoa.
Dave Cravotta
Yes.
Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
Whoa, So like.
Reed
That's trippy. So Jared
Dave Cravotta
Yeah. Yeah.
Steve
That's right.
Reed
Leto's the lead singer of a band called 30 Seconds to Mars. Phenomenal band. We kind of broke up with them for a little bit, put their back.
Jason Ziolo
Really wanted to talk about meatloaf though. Come on, you opened
up that opportunity to talk about meatloaf in Fight Club. Anyways, okay, I guess we can talk about Jared Leto. Go ahead.
Reed
Bob? No, but the way, that's
Dave Cravotta
He was Robert Pearson.
Steve
name is Robert Paulson.
Reed
not what we're talking about. We're talking about Jared Leto's singing style. And I had never understood how that dude can still be performing without, he reminds me of who was that ska band where they basically had to quit for three years because dude blew out his voice.
Jason Ziolo
Yeah.
Dave Cravotta
Yes.
Jason Ziolo
I don't, the band that won't
knock on wood who's got the backup say, the Boss Tones, the mighty, mighty Boss Tones. You see my skanking? That got into my head.
Dave Cravotta
Anybody blast stones?
Reed
Mighty Mighty Ballstones. Yeah.
Steve
Yeah.
Reed
He was similar in like his singing style is like Jared Leto was and I just don't understand how Jared Leto can pull it off. Tell me how.
Dave Cravotta
⁓ good question. Well, screaming gets a little, is a little different because there are lots of different kinds of screams, so, ⁓
Reed
Strain. Let me
say it differently. Have you listened to 30 Seconds of Mars? So yeah, it's like a strain. It sounds like it's... Yeah.
Dave Cravotta
yeah, yeah I really like them. I love their first few records.
Jason Ziolo
their first two records were amazing.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah,
man, their self-titled record with the kill on it is one of my favorite records by any band. That's so good. My guess is he's doing fry scream, which means you... If you've heard of glottal fry... That kind of sound. That's glottal fry. If you can add a little bit of energy to that, which I can't do it very well, it's actually really easy to do and it doesn't hurt your vocal cords, but it's inherently loud.
Reed
⁓ so good.
Dave Cravotta
And so that kind of scream that he's able to do another artist like him, Chester Bennington's a great example. Put me out of my misery when he holds out that misery, he's holding that out a super long time because a lot of that is fry scream. It might be hybrid, I'm sure people are gonna kill me in the comments for that. But anyhow, you can hold out fry scream and it doesn't destroy your voice in the same way that we might think. When normal normies, muggles scream, we use a lot of tension in our voice and we can wreck our chords pretty quickly.
Reed
We love trolls.
Interesting.
Dave Cravotta
But when you know what you're doing and I assume that Leto does, especially with all of the training that he's had, he's probably able to do it because he's not injuring himself. But there are a lot of artists who do. Who the Shadows had from A7X, he had vocal surgery. Adele's had vocal surgery. John Mayer. Steven Tyler from Aerosmith. I mean the list just goes on and on and on about Haley Williams was one earlier in her career.
Jason Ziolo
I'm sure.
Dave Cravotta
There's a whole bunch of folks that have had vocal surgery because they haven't been able to quite do it right. But yeah, what you're hearing most of the time when you're hearing screamers who've been doing it for a long time haven't gotten hurt means their technique is excellent. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. All technique. Yeah, for that specific thing. Yeah. So the... ⁓ go ahead.
Reed
their Courtney LaPlants.
That's awesome.
Jason Ziolo
Sweet. Dave, when
are we going to your office so you can shove cameras down our throats and we can see what it looks like? Because we talked about the first podcast we ever did and we haven't come back to it.
Reed
Ha
Dave Cravotta
man. ⁓
Yeah, the I have no idea. You know what? My equipment is it's portable so I could easily bring it up to Chicago and we could. Yeah, absolutely. And we could line them up and take a look at everybody's voice boxes and I can tell you what's going on in there and. Happy to do it.
Jason Ziolo
⁓ even better. ⁓
Reed
Road trip.
Jason Ziolo
This
is something we need to do and okay, yeah, okay. This is exactly what we said last time too. And this is first time we've talked about it.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah.
Reed
Yes.
Do you know that I've-
Dave Cravotta
Yes. Yeah.
Reed
I have never
lost my voice, ever. Isn't that crazy?
Dave Cravotta
wow. Count yourself lucky.
Yeah, that's... I...
Reed
So
let's try to make that happen.
Jason Ziolo
Yeah
Dave Cravotta
We'll do what we can. That sounds good. Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
Thanks for sharing all that, Dave. Really fascinating to see the actual what's going on with this stuff versus just the internet bullshit people guessing.
Parker
I'll invite my friend and we'll do that.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah.
I mean it is the people that I see in my office that are the most distressed tend to be people who are singers who are having trouble with their voices. And they'll say, I know it's just singing, but I love to sing. Like it's a part of your identity. And when you can't do it, you feel broken. And I'm sure that's something that Katz is going through. He's like, this is me. This is what I do. This is my identity and I can't do it. And I don't feel like a complete person. And he was struggling with that before he ever even stepped on stage. So when you got those two things going combined,
He is in a tough place. So I'm hopeful that with a good plan that he gets some help specifically just from a voice standpoint and gets better and gets back out there because that's what he does.
Jason Ziolo
Yep, me too. Sweet. Tell me about Randy Blythe and his singing style, because that guy can howl and scream like nobody else.
Dave Cravotta
Yes.
Yeah,
I was watching Jared Dines. Yes, he was talking, actually I was watching a documentary from about Lamb of God. I think it was when they made Sacrament. I talked about it before and somebody asked him, how do you do all those sounds? And he's like, I don't know, figured out how to do it and that's just how I do it. He is doing
Jason Ziolo
Brandy Blythe, of course, from Lamb of God.
Dave Cravotta
He's not a fry screamer. think he's more the what they call a false cord scream which is still a little bit of misnomer You do have things that are called false vocal folds, but you're not actually vibrating those when you're doing that kind of scream It's a different part. It doesn't matter. That's just what we call it He does that and then he over articulates all of his sounds He like says all the sounds to get this really specific kind of sound out of his voice But he doesn't get hurt because he's not really using his vocal cords when he does it Fun story
I was, because we got to talk about him on every podcast, two weeks ago I was evaluating a patient. Hold on, no, but there he is. No, it's a different guy that we always talk about. Yes. So two weeks ago, I'm evaluating a lady and about, she's having voice difficulty. She loves to sing and she can't hit the high notes in church anymore. And she's kind of hitting retirement age and that's pretty common around that age to just start having changes to your voice. You can't sing the way you used to.
Reed
Is this a Josh Frees segment?
Jason Ziolo
Now we check that box now.
Reed
All right, good. Yeah, that segment
brought to you by Josh Fries. Okay, moving on.
Dave Cravotta
So she comes to me for help and we're talking and somehow we got on the subject of how I like metal music and stuff like that and her husband says to me she goes, ⁓ like sound of silence from Disturbed.
Jason Ziolo
Hahaha
Steve
I'm going to do that.
Reed
⁓
Dave Cravotta
I thought if you immediately
read, I started dying. was like, well, I actually like the original. I said, no, even like more extreme than that. And I ended up showing him the Will Ramos video of the scope and all that stuff. And he also just kind of figured out how to do it. So I feel like there's a couple different ways. Some people just figure out how to do it. And some people just they get trained how to do it. Randy Blythe just figured out how to do it. He's like, this is what I'm going to do with my voice.
Reed
You did that on purpose.
Jason Ziolo
You
Steve
Yeah.
Dave Cravotta
If you listen to early Lamb of God records, he pretty much just has one sound. It's that one screamy, over-articulated sound. There's not a lot of highs and lows or anything, but if you listen to some of his other stuff, he can sing. Like, dude's got a voice. And I want to say, like, self-titled and later is like, ⁓ now we're getting more range and dynamics in his voice. I think he gets way more interesting as the records come out. I think this latest one, Perfect Sight Way,
Steve
Yeah.
Reed
confidence.
Steve
Yeah,
perfect.
Dave Cravotta
was like, some
of his best vocal stuff. And it's, I think it's produced really well too. But he's just vocally all over the place and it's awesome.
Steve
It's an amazing record.
It's really fucking good.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah.
Reed
Do you believe,
okay, so just a little previous history for all y'all who don't get as heavy as Lamb of God is. So Lamb of God started in 1994. That's how long these dudes have been around. Their first band was called Burn the Priest. And then they actually ended up changing the album because somebody departed Burn the Priest and then they wanted to change it because it sounded too satanic.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah. Yep.
Jason Ziolo
No, they were getting shit about it being too religious, so they're like, well, we're gonna go all in religious then and call it Lamb of God, really piss off the Christians.
Reed
Yeah.
well, okay. I could have sworn they changed it because they thought it was just too satanic. And then they went Lamb of God and went a little bit more, you know, still in the religion of it all, but a little bit less burning of the priests.
Jason Ziolo
That was less priest burning.
Dave Cravotta
It's... I feel like it's
tongue-in-cheek. It's kind of poking fun a little bit without being so obvious, I guess. Because you hear about the... I think it was in North Carolina. People were calling in or showing up to a Lamb of God event. And it was... I think it was... It was a Lamb of God show. And it was people expecting a worship experience. And they got the band. I'm like, whoops. Totally.
Reed
Yeah. Yeah.
Steve
Yeah.
Reed
Yes. Yeah.
I mean, that's still a worship experience.
Steve
Well, yeah, that's what Jason
was doing on Friday or what was it, yesterday?
Jason Ziolo
I texted you guys, I'm like, when you're with the Alexa, do not ask to listen to Lamb of God, because you get worship music. Even my wife looked at me like, what are you listening to down here? I'm like, Alexa's confused.
Steve
Yeah.
Reed
So these guys have been around since 1994 and they just released their 10th studio album on Friday called Into Oblivion. And like we've all been texting about it because we were all super stoked that this thing was going to be coming out to begin with. But without a no joke, that's not how the kids say it. So no cap, high key. This is I think like the actually the best Lamb of God album that they've ever released. That is just insane to think about a band that's been around.
Steve
It's really good.
Reed
for
almost 30 years, more than 30 years, right? Math is hard. And 10 albums into this thing, and they're releasing their best work to date 30 years into this thing is incredible to me.
Jason Ziolo
Yep.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah, right on.
Parker
But
they're also one of those bands that.
knows what to do. Every album that they have released has been distinctively Lamb of God for the most part. Everything hits just like, you know, Sacrament and all of those songs. Lamb of... They're one of those bands that comes on no doubt it's Lamb of God. every... And they're no... They're not strangers to mainstream success either. They were nominated for a Grammy in 2007. So like they...
Dave Cravotta
Nothing.
Reed
Yeah.
Yeah, that's fair.
Jason Ziolo
That does not give them credibility
here, Parker. Come on. What does that really mean?
Parker
No, but they bridge gaps.
I'm saying they bridge gaps. Didn't Avenge Seven Fold play at one of the Grammys?
Dave Cravotta
people other than Metalheads have recognized they're awesome. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Jason Ziolo
Yeah, okay.
Steve
Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
Again, was the people thinking they looked at
all the metal bands like, must be the worship music. I'm gonna choose that one. We can actually listen to the metal category.
Reed
was nominated in the religious category.
Parker
It was nominated for best metal performance. Best metal performance in 2007. Jason, one of your favorite bands played at the Grammys of Venge 7 Folds. you know, they... Bridging Gaps is what I'm saying. They're not strangers.
Dave Cravotta
They've transcended.
Jason Ziolo
Hahaha!
Did A7X really play with the
Grammys? I actually didn't know about that. That's interesting.
Parker
Maybe not the great they they did play it a music award show that is way more mainstream and popular than then I Could be wrong about the Grammys, but I'm pretty sure they had a performance Somewhere ⁓
Jason Ziolo
Alright, alright, alright, alright.
All of my army
of robots back checked you. Back, back to check you.
Parker
Yes. But regardless, Lamb of God bridges gaps, right? I mean, what metal band can say that they were nominated for a Grammy, you know, really at all, ever, of their caliber, right? I mean, they're not sing-songy chorus metal, right? It's pretty hardcore through and through. They're screaming the whole time.
So it's just, it is crazy that this band happens to be one of those bands. for Will Ramos' band, ⁓ Yeah, Lorna Shore. They were at Lala, Palooza. You know, some of these bands that are like hardcore and hit heavy, they just figure it out and they somehow bridge the gap between these different genres.
Dave Cravotta
Learner Store.
Reed
Yeah.
Lollapalooza opens at 11 o'clock in the morning and Lorna Shore got the 11 o'clock slate. Like, I'm getting there early, I guess.
Parker
Correct.
Dave Cravotta
Ugh.
Parker
Yes.
Jason Ziolo
They announced the Lollapalooza lineup this week. ⁓ It's exactly what you expected it to be, a bunch of pop bands. Now we're not gonna go there, back to Lamb of God.
Reed
They sure did, buddy.
No, it's... But...
Alright, so lame-a-god people I have a question because they they parted ways with their the original drummer was Chris Adler And then why did Adler leave? Did they fire his ass or is it does anybody know this I could Google it but I'm not I thought maybe if somebody would know
Dave Cravotta
Adler, yeah.
I don't know off top of my head. I thought that he left because basically musical differences. But then I'm on the Wikipedia page of all things. It says that he left because of developing musicians dystonia, a neurological condition that causes nerve deterioration. And in his case, it was in his right foot. So after growing tensions with the band, particularly after his time serving as Megadeth's drummer, they eventually told Adler that his services were no longer required.
Reed
But it's the love of God.
Ooh.
Dave Cravotta
So he's on this record, but I thought he was back, but maybe he's not?
So, well, look at this.
Reed
Wait, so he's got something that
he's got like a medical condition?
Dave Cravotta
medical
condition yeah that means that he can't play like he usually plays yeah and if you're right for the right for that's working the kick drum and if you can't do that quite right now
Reed
Yeah, that's kind of a problem.
Jason Ziolo
They're both pretty
important when you're playing metal music like that.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah, that's going to be problematic.
Reed
Huh. I mean, not as bad as like Randy Blythe going down, like, it'd be like Austin Carlisle of Mice and Men with Marfrans all of sudden no longer can sing. that was kind of a, it's kind of a bad thing for a metal band to lose your lead singer, but.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah.
Parker
I
was wrong. ⁓
Dave Cravotta
Yes.
Parker
I'm bench seven full play at the MTV Awards, I was wrong. Not a Grammy.
Reed
That doesn't... that
Jason Ziolo
No, I
Reed
still... it still counts.
Jason Ziolo
looked it up too. Bullshit, Parker, no way. I looked it up too. And I literally, this is what I found. Nothing's good. And I'm talking to AI, OK, so take that for what you will too. But nothing's coming up for Avenged at the AMAs or similar mainstream shows. However, they won the best new artist for Bat Country at the 2006 VMAs. But it didn't say they played it. And then they did get nominated in the 2018 Grammys, but they didn't even go to the Grammys. They said, fuck that. Like, they shouldn't.
Parker
You did?
Hahaha!
Yes.
Yeah, yeah. So, my apologies. They didn't play, but they've been around the circling the drain there.
Jason Ziolo
Cool.
Parker
Maybe we should have asked you about the switch method.
Jason Ziolo
I, in my opinion, on the Lamb of God album was
it sounded like Lamb of God and when it gets to a certain screamy heaviness level, it all sounds ACDC to me, where it's all kind of the same thing over and over and over and over again. So there was the one that won, there was one that made me poke my head out and go, I really like that one. think it was something about a stream. look how prepared I am for this, Sunday nights. ⁓ Lamb of God.
Dave Cravotta
You
Reed
This may go down
as our worst podcast to date.
Parker
You
Jason Ziolo
⁓
The killing floor was my favorite one.
Reed
Are you talking about a song on the...
Yeah, that's a...
Steve
Yeah, that one stood out for me too. And then there was another one too, L... Huh?
Jason Ziolo
Elvateo!
Elvateo? Elvacio?
Steve
Yeah,
yeah, I'm gonna butcher it if I try to say it, ⁓
Reed
Do it anyways.
Jason Ziolo
Hahaha
Reed
And I think it's El vacío, by the way. don't think it's, since it's Spanish, the C would more... El vacayo!
Dave Cravotta
I think you're right. does sound...
Jason Ziolo
I like my pronunciation
way better.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah. The first three tracks on this record are...
Jason Ziolo
All right, gentlemen, let's get on with it. Let's get off
this and let's get on to some new topics here. It's trivia time. Okay. As I told some of you beforehand, this is going to be a little background. Some of these, I didn't know how hard to go, because some of these are really obvious to me, but there's some things I dig in here that you guys might not know much about. So I kept some of them high level. We'll see how it goes. We had a nice little platform set up that didn't work. So instead, we're just going to shout it out and be idiots. So here we go.
Reed
Trust me.
Jason Ziolo
Josh Friese is the wrong answer. ⁓
Reed
Damn it. That's not true.
Josh Fees is the right answer.
Jason Ziolo
This Brighton band started in 2004, twin brothers, one behind the drum kit, one on guitar, building one of the most technically ambitious metalcore sounds in the UK. For years they toured, with anyone who'd have them, they slowly built a fan base, but in 2016, they lost their founding guitarist. The drummer's own twin brother, to melanoma, which hits home for me, because I'm a melanoma survivor, at just 28 years old.
Nobody would have blamed them for calling it quits, but instead they got even bigger, went to the top of the UK charts, toured with Metallica, headlined the Downward Festival with 11 studio albums and one of the biggest metal exports Britain has ever seen. Who are they?
Dave Cravotta
Northlane?
Jason Ziolo
And I give you
more hints if you need, but I'll keep it high level until then.
Parker
Architects, hell. Yeah, that whole house, holy hell.
Dave Cravotta
Is it Northlane? ⁓ bloody hell. Yes, Parker. Good call.
Jason Ziolo
Parker is absolutely right, architects.
Reed
Wow! I didn't know they were brothers!
Steve
Nice.
Dave Cravotta
I didn't either.
Jason Ziolo
Yeah, so Tom
was the singer who died of melanoma at 28 and Dan is the drummer.
Parker
Yeah.
Yes.
Jason Ziolo
And they
started in 2004 and really didn't break open until 2018. So they were at it for a long time. They were a totally different band.
Dave Cravotta
Wow.
That's a lot of ground.
Parker
They
dropped ⁓ the Holy Hill album after major success with the prior one.
I can't remember the name, something no gods or something like that. can't remember the album name. holy hell, that was the whole melanoma incident and that just exploded them. And ever since, they've been rising.
Dave Cravotta
I have tickets to see them in May and I cannot wait for that show. They're at the top of my list of bands that I really want to see. I heard it's very Sam Carter focused but that dude's amazing. Talk about doing all the voices for all the things.
Jason Ziolo
Yeah.
Reed
so jealous.
Yes.
Parker
Yes. Yeah.
They've recently taken a very bring me the horizon path, I guess.
Kind of more focusing on the front man, which you know is fine and and less so about the the heavy hitting a lot of more core stuff came through and you know the the big huge Production sound that you get with bring me, you know, they're trying to do this a very similar thing So my cup of tea was you know, holy hell right when that broke out I
went to about four shows to see them. But they're still very good. But yes, they're very much front man focus now. But they still hit hard when they play for live shows.
Reed
Listen.
I read an article like a week or two ago, somebody just absolutely destroying Jordan Fish and how he's like making all of these guys like these more mainstream bands and they're like talking about how, you know, he's working with Poppy and she went from this kind of like kind of niche player in the metal scene and now she's like exploding but it's all because it's never heard of her. Yeah, right.
Jason Ziolo
I didn't know you were into Poppy, Reed. That's another one that we podcast.
Dave Cravotta
Hahaha
Parker
Ha
ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
Reed
And now it's all just like this formulaic how to make like, you know, metal for the masses. And I was reading this article and like, they're right. But also, I really like what Jordan Fish is doing.
Dave Cravotta
Hmm.
Parker
It's a fair critique, but also on the flip side, know, all these bands that work with him somehow find success. So he must be doing something right. But at the same time, you know, there's, you know, when Wage War, remember when Wage War was going strong, they had such a pure metalist following, right? And then they worked with Jeremy from
Reed
Yeah.
Parker
What is that? A day to remember. And they had started to work with bands, not bands, people like Marshmello trying to kind of move more mainstream. And then Wage War did the same thing. And it's the same kind of critique, right? Some of these bands that are looking to grow.
Dave Cravotta
Mm-hmm.
Parker
It's like a weird balance, right? I don't know how I would, how do you navigate that when you're a band that's like on the verge of breaking out and you have an opportunity to work with a guy who's very clearly able to bring you success, but it may, it may, maybe you take a right turn, you know, and not go straight down the path you were. Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
You take that shot if you're given
it, is the way I would look at it when you're an upcoming band. And it sounds horrible to say, but even if it's maybe a little outside your comfort zone, when you get paired up with one of the biggest names in the scene, and he says, try something different, you go, you listen and you open up your brain. some bands get criticism for that stuff, but at the same time, it's not like they're saying, go boy band it out. They're saying, try something different, work with this guy as an influence and see what happens.
Parker
Right? Right.
Thank
Dave Cravotta
Yeah.
Reed
Yep, agreed. You gotta take a shot.
Jason Ziolo
I'm all for it.
Yup.
Dave Cravotta
There's a
really good podcast called Song Exploder. I may have mentioned it before. I don't know if you guys have heard of it, but it's a guy...
Jason Ziolo
Yeah, Local H has been on
it a couple of times with their albums. It's really cool.
Dave Cravotta
There's
a really good one with the Goo Goo Dolls when they talk about Iris, which is a phenomenal song. I thought Goo Goo Dolls were always kind of like a pop rock band. And no, they started off as a punk band in Buffalo. And then somehow, ⁓ they wrote name and then that was kind of big. So this movie producer contacted Johnny Resnick and said, I want a song for my movie. man, what was the name of that
Jason Ziolo
There was, I know what it was, it was like a romantic comedy, so it was an angel that came back and fell in love with an angel or something.
Dave Cravotta
Yes
Reed
No, Nicolas Cage.
It was a Nick Cage movie, wasn't it?
Dave Cravotta
I don't know, something about angels. And I'm sure people in the comments will tell us all about it. Except only our moms are watching us live. None of them know it. City of Angels? No. Anyhow. he said, he's a resnic, I want a song that we can put in this movie. And so they wrote, he wrote, he told this whole story about how he wrote Iris.
Steve
Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
It's adorable you think we have people in the comments section,
Reed
City of Angels.
Jason Ziolo
City of Angels with Nicolette Cage.
Dave Cravotta
And then when they played it, the guy was like, I, song is great, but I only want this little part. I want you to just do an acoustic version, just stripped down. But when they were recording, their recording producer said, hey, this could really use some strings. And Resnick looked at his musician partner, I don't know his name. It was like, once we do this, there's no going back. We're not punk anymore. We're a pop band. And the guy was like, but this is going to work. And they listened to it like, ⁓ this is incredible. And it was really good. And then they launched into this whole career.
Jason Ziolo
you
Dave Cravotta
of kind of pop rock music but you're right like what do do I mean the like the bands of the eighties the Motley Crue's of the world and kiss how many farewell tours are they doing well if you can still go out there and play and you have a good time and you're making money while you're doing it you're on the road like hell not I don't know I can't blame people for wanting to go play and get paid for it go for it
Reed
Hey.
Parker
Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
And a lot of people.
Reed
And if you're Johnny
Resnick, all those 50 year old house moms are still swooning over you, so...
Dave Cravotta
Yes,
100%.
Jason Ziolo
Well, and that's the
thing. Even if you're going, I may be selling out a little bit. It might be that when people are on Broadway or people entertain for a living and act in a movie, it doesn't define them. It's a role to entertain. And there's a little bit of that going on too. Now, I'm careful there because I also very believe in the true spirit of rock and roll being you and who you are. But there is an element of you're there to entertain as well.
Dave Cravotta
Right.
Yeah,
Jason Ziolo
All right, next
question, good one. All right, you got one more, do it.
Parker
⁓ before, for all the marbles,
all the marbles, it's City of Angels.
Dave Cravotta
Yes. You win.
Parker
Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
with Mick McRyan
Steve
in
Jason Ziolo
and Nick Cage.
Parker
And also just because we talked about Tom and he did pass, I just want to give him credit because he was the mastermind for Architects. I want to get their album correct. So the correct album name was All Our Gods Have Abandoned Us. That's what set them on fire. And then when he passed, holy hell, know, amplified it.
Dave Cravotta
I need to listen that record. Also, I was wrong. Chris Adler is not drumming for Lamb of God. He was out before the pandemic and has not been back since. Cruz is still drumming for this. So I don't know where I read that. Mioculpa. Forgive me.
Reed
Yeah, me too.
Right. Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
In 2021, we were coming back after the COVID, after COVID, and live music came back in a roaring way. Fans hadn't been to a show in over a year, and pent-up demand was unlike anything the industry has ever seen. One American rock festival capitalized on that energy harder than anyone else, setting a record for the largest rock festival in the world that year at that time.
Reed
We're gonna have a lot of errors and missions.
Parker
Yes.
Jason Ziolo
Line up Metallica, Nine Inch Nails, Guns N' Roses, Slipknot, kind of in the south and over time continues to become one of the biggest festivals in Metal and Rock.
Parker
Do we have a year?
What year?
Jason Ziolo
2021 right after COVID.
Steve
Was that Sick New World or?
Dave Cravotta
Yes.
Reed
The signal world was an arambic.
Dave Cravotta
That's Vegas,
Steve
That's Vegas, Sickening Worlds in Vegas.
Jason Ziolo
was in Kentucky.
Reed
Was in Kentucky? Yeah, right? wow.
Dave Cravotta
Louder than life?
Jason Ziolo
louder than life.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah, it's
normal. It's two hours from me.
Reed
LOL. That's a, that is a great festival though. That's awesome. That's...
Steve
Love it.
Jason Ziolo
Hello?
Dave Cravotta
I've never been. That would be fun.
Jason Ziolo
All the
DWP Fest I've been to have been really pretty incredible. remember they had Shots? What's that? DWP is Danny Wibner Presents. Danny Wibner does a lot of the big rock festivals that you hear about. And some of the, he's got a country festival too. Like Aftershock, Sonic Temple, Louder Than Life. I'm sure I'm missing a couple other ones in there. They're all kind of the same, Welcome to Rockville. They're all kind of the same format. You kind of see the same bands headline them every year.
Reed
Yeah, who's DWP Jason?
incarceration.
Jason Ziolo
It's because it's all kind of one collab. And he does a really good job. They used to have a Chicago one called Chicago Open Air. It was only around for two years. Reid, we went to those and saw corn for like the millionth time. I know you weren't there, Steve. But saw corn there. And then we did the three days one. It was awesome. So, Loud Again Life. It runs every September and it's a one day.
Reed
He really does.
Dave Cravotta
You
Parker
He also does a
Jason Ziolo
One day in a four day event, depending on how long you wanna stick around for. And of course, 2021 was insane. I remember my first show of 2021 after things opened up and it was Riot Fest and Smashing Pumpkins were unleashed from their metaphoric cage. That's horrible, I'm sorry. No, but Smashing Pumpkins came out and played their first show after COVID. So it literally been years and you could just tell they needed to get out and the energy was.
So fucking amazing. So I can't imagine what Louder Than Life was there. And that's right when Metallica had finished 72 seasons coming out. I don't think it was out yet, but they had just been like wrapping it up and they came out and played a couple songs, I think. It was all a big deal. It's pretty cool.
Dave Cravotta
yeah.
Reed
There's nine
seconds left of Iowa-Florida-Upp-1 if you see me staring off into space.
Dave Cravotta
Woo! That'd
Parker
Yeah,
Dave Cravotta
be a fun upset. I didn't pick him to go to the Final Four. That's right, knock him out.
Parker
yeah, yeah.
Jason Ziolo
No, it's March Madness season.
Parker
Here it
is. DWP also posts Sonic Temple.
Jason Ziolo
You guys wanna go harder or easier? That one was pretty easy.
We're gonna go deep, deep into Jason's past. We'll see if you guys can get any of this stuff. Growing up in a small, what's that? Was that? I asked Carlson if he wanted to come tonight and he's like, I gotta be in bed by 8.30, so I can't do it. So, he gets no props. growing up in a small town in Pennsylvania, moved to.
Dave Cravotta
Zarlson. The answer is Zarlson.
Early riser, no?
Jason Ziolo
blah blah, I'm not going to tell you what blah blah is because I think it'll give it away. But moved somewhere else to pursue music and ended up becoming one of the most influential figures in industrial rock history. Not just as a performer, but as a producer, tastemaker, and eventually a label founder. His own band pioneered a sound that blended industrial noise, electronic production, and raw emotional fury in a way nobody had heard before. Dark, abrasive, and deeply personal. It wasn't just a band, it was a blueprint for an entire generation.
So it made sense when he launched his own record label, the roster sounded like a who's who of artists in the same dark and compromising space. The label became known for taking chances on acts that major labels wouldn't touch. Weird, heavy, confrontational music that fit nowhere else. So who's the musician that founded the record label and named me three bands off that label?
Reed
Trent Resonant,
nine inch nails.
Dave Cravotta
You me.
Jason Ziolo
Okay, what's the label and give me three bands? No.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah, Interscope Records,
Reed
No, no
Gravity kills on that label?
Dave Cravotta
Mmm, good one.
Jason Ziolo
No.
The label is Nothing Records. In the late 90s, it was a real big deal and he pulled some big acts and some smaller acts into the mainstream with that label.
Dave Cravotta
⁓ yeah, of course.
was ministry.
ministry on them. The ministry was big before Nine Inch Nails, I feel it. Big.
Reed
industries.
Jason Ziolo
For sure,
ministry was around coming up around the same time they were. Ministry is not on their, think of bands that,
Reed
Filter wasn't on there, right?
Parker
Is Manson on there?
Dave Cravotta
⁓ yeah,
I think they were.
Parker
Is Manson on there?
Reed
⁓
Jason Ziolo
Manson
Reed
NOOOO
Jason Ziolo
is one them. And Reed's screaming at the TV. Manson is probably the biggest artist to come out of.
Dave Cravotta
in Florida loose.
Reed
Not only did they just hit a three pointer, so they're up one Iowa. There's four seconds left. If the score stays as it ends, I win $500. No, I win 700.
Jason Ziolo
Ooh, okay, we'll root for that.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah. Hang on, let me pull up that. I need to watch the end of that score. you'll keep us posted, I'm sure, Reed.
Jason Ziolo
Okay.
Reed
Obviously, 4 seconds is an eternity.
Jason Ziolo
Marilyn Manson,
Parker
I've got it up too.
I've got it up. I just didn't scream as loud as he did.
Jason Ziolo
here's a band called...
I've lost
the crowd.
Dave Cravotta
That was a crowd.
Reed
I mean, we said we weren't going over an hour, so.
Parker
I
thought Reid was screaming because he didn't realize Marilyn Manson was on nothing records.
Dave Cravotta
That's right, yeah.
Reed
You
Jason Ziolo
So, Nothing Records, founded in 1992, threw Interscope Records, Dave. So you're not completely wrong. The bands on the record were, see if you know any of these, Marilyn Manson, Prick, Prick was a huge band for me in high school, but they were totally underground. Pop Will Eat Itself, another huge band for me in high school. The dude from Pop Will Eat Itself actually went on and he wrote the,
Dave Cravotta
Hmm ⁓
Yep, heard of them.
Jason Ziolo
wrote the score for what's the movie? I've got it written right here.
Requiem for a Dream, which went on and it's now one of the most famous scores ever. And the lead singer, and Trent Reznor helped him go from lead singer of Papa lead himself to being a, you know, basically a writing music for songs. And it's eventually how Trent Reznor got into doing scores for the social network and Tron and all those kinds of movies.
Reed
Ooh.
Dave Cravotta
Hmm.
movie scores.
I love you.
seven.
Really? He's such a badass. He's one of my heroes. Fun story about Requiem for a Dream. One year for Easter, my wife bought me that DVD thinking it was something else and I'm like, this is not a happy movie. For those who don't know, Requiem for a Dream is based in Coney Island. It is a...
Jason Ziolo
Really? There you go.
Reed
That's cool. He is such a badass and as my wa-
That's amazing.
Jason Ziolo
I don't know if I've ever seen it.
I'm confusing it with the basketball diaries.
Parker
It's a sad movie.
Dave Cravotta
It's very, very sad.
Parker
honorable mention, MBM on that record, label two, meet beat manifesto.
Jason Ziolo
Yes, very good.
Dave Cravotta
I've heard that before ⁓
Parker
I very
barely know them, but I have had my brush with them.
Jason Ziolo
I
only know them because a girl I dated in high school, said name dropped them all the time. Other bands, Pig, 12 Rounds, Einstergein Neubotin, I don't know how to pronounce that, The The, and then my personal, one of my personal favorites on the list, Two. number Two, W-O. So instead of a T, it's Two W-O. Do you know who, it's a solo project. Do you know who Two consists of?
Parker
No.
Jason Ziolo
came out and put out an industrial record in the 90s from one of the biggest metal bands to ever exist, Rob Halford of Judas Priest.
Dave Cravotta
⁓
Reed
three, two,
Jason Ziolo
Hahaha
So Regis won $700, so good for him.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah,
Reed's buying drinks next time we all get together in person, which will also be our first time all together in person.
Jason Ziolo
Hell yeah.
Parker
I
Reed
We've got a square. So the winner's gotta have ended three and the loser's gotta end in two. And it's $1,000 a square. We've got a bunch of buddies in on it. So it's not like I paid $1,000 for the square, but second round pays off pretty big.
Jason Ziolo
Nice work, dude.
Dave Cravotta
Well done,
Reed
God, what a Sunday.
Jason Ziolo
All right, I keep it going. Next one. This band crawled out of England. England deathcore for Parker in the mid 2000s. Brutal heavy. Brutal heavy. They've since transformed. Behind that transformation, their front man was quietly falling apart. He'd been remarkably public about a ketamine addiction that brought him to a point of complete physical psychological collapse. He got clean credits, the experience with changing everything.
Dave Cravotta
Yes.
Jason Ziolo
and now become one of the biggest rock acts in the world. Name the artist.
Dave Cravotta
I'm gonna need a hint.
Parker
That's a bring me horizon, I think.
Reed
⁓ that seemed too obvious.
Dave Cravotta
Bye.
Jason Ziolo
namely artists.
Dave Cravotta
Wow.
Parker
Yep,
and they are very heavy in their early days. Wait, what am I naming now?
Reed
Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
What's name of the artist? That was the question. Yes, so Ollie Sykes will bring me the horizon. Yeah, I actually purposely worded that one to lead into the death core and just be like, they transformed a little bit. To try and throw you guys off.
Parker
Ollie Sykes?
Dave Cravotta
Mmm.
Parker
you
Reed
Their first couple albums were
so good.
Parker
They were very heavy in their very early days. And they have transformed into...
Reed
Yes. Awesome, though. not like Parker, you and I
can you and I like I dip into your edge of the music, but like I kind of lose it when I can't understand what they're saying. Like those first couple of records on Bring Me to the Horizon were so good because it was like very heavy. There was a lot of growling and screaming, but it like Ali does it so well that's like you can still hear all the lyrics and everything. And then you put all that crap in the background that they were doing. It was just those couple of albums were off the charts. Good.
Parker
Yeah
They
were very much trailblazers with ambience, which if you're a metal band these days and you're not using ambience and you're trying to be in that modern space, everyone uses ambience now and they trailblaze that. So, so.
Dave Cravotta
Mm-hmm.
Reed
I don't know what that is. Can somebody explain that to me?
Parker
So you have the forward instruments, guitar, bass, drums, vocals, right? And what bands started to do is actually really early, they started to add electronics. What was that like transformer sound? What is that music called? Yes, dubstep. That was a big thing.
Dave Cravotta
jeez, yeah, I really like dubstep.
Jason Ziolo
I always call it trance dubstep.
You said transformer sound,
knew exactly what you were talking about.
Parker
Yes, yes,
that was a big thing in the 2010s. Dubstep started to make its way into metalcore specifically for what I was listening to. And then it started to transform. what was transforming was Bring Me the Horizon and some of these forefront up. Born of Osiris is a huge one. They started to add what some would consider backing tracks, but they're not fully, truly backing tracks because they're not necessarily instrumentals.
Dave Cravotta
Mm-hmm.
Parker
tracked and they're not you know so they're not like cheating where
backing instruments and playing and not really playing the instruments but they add these creepy noises and I do this in pillars actually we have a lot of music and you just get a synth you get a piano you can even fuck around with your guitar and and really make things sound weird and you just turn up the vibrato and just make it freaking weird and you just let it go
and then you and then you put it underneath where you can barely hear it and it just elevates the music to a whole nother level.
Reed
I feel so
in that sense then that was on bring me the horizons there is a hell.
Parker
Yes. Yes. And there's different levels, right? You can do it right in your face, just like all the other instruments, or you can do it a little more subtly. But when bands started to do this, era does it, right? Era, currents, all these modern bands. What's that? Bless it all? Wait, they all, yeah. It adds a whole bunch of pressure. Yeah.
Dave Cravotta
Bless the Fall does that a lot too. Bless the Fall does that a lot. That's what I'm running through my head. Yeah, I feel like it adds a lot of tension. It's not instruments, but it's like all this building tension
and then when the instruments come in just BOOM! It just feels like it hits bigger because the tension's been building and that's the release. Yeah, I'm totally with you Parker. That stuff is, yeah. Adding the ⁓ ambiance is huge.
Parker
Yes. Yep.
Jason Ziolo
Three questions left, but I'm only asking two of them, because they're good and I really wanna talk. you're leaving me. One more, one more, two more, three more. Classic rock, 2000s rock or current rock?
Reed
Guys I threw up my shoulder when I was celebrating.
One more and then it's over. because I got, yeah, I gotta go.
2000s. Limp Bizkit.
Jason Ziolo
All right, you
guys should all be able to know this one. Actually, it might be a little too easy. We're doing it anyways. 2013, one of the most respected drummers in metal history stepped down from the band he was helped to building. The announcement was a single cold statement on the band's website with zero explanation. No farewell, no reason giving, nothing. Fans were devastated, confused. Rumors swirled for years. Was it drugs created differences? Falling out? The truth didn't come out till years later when it reframed everything.
turned out the drummer was secretly battling a neurological disease that attacked his spinal cord and robbed him of the ability to use his legs and was essentially fired while fighting to walk, while he's trying to walk again, let alone play drums. He never told a single person what he was going through. He passed away in 2021. Who is he and what band?
Parker
this slipknot and it's Joey Jordan.
Dave Cravotta
Joey Jordanson.
Yeah, good call, Parker. You win another point.
Jason Ziolo
Joey Jordansson.
Reed
⁓ wow,
yeah.
Jason Ziolo
Parker's
pulling these ones out, I'm impressed.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah.
Reed
Yeah, Parker wins the wins the Sunday matinee.
Parker
This is my realm, Metal is my realm. Everything else, I'll listen and learn.
Jason Ziolo
Could you imagine?
Dave Cravotta
Yeah.
Reed
So did
Jay, did he come in after him?
Jason Ziolo
Yes, Weinberg came in after him.
Parker
Yep.
Jason Ziolo
It's, I remember when this all went down, everyone was really like, they fired him and then they didn't give him any explanation and people were pissed about it. And it's just a whole weird situation. Like I don't get where his brain was at where he's like, I don't want to share what I'm going. Maybe he was scared the band was going to fire him. And I guess they ultimately did.
Dave Cravotta
Yeah.
And what do do if you can't do this stuff anymore? And that sucks.
Reed
Love you, Steve.
Jason Ziolo
Bye, Steez. All right, gentlemen, we got one more bonus question, because I'm a jerk. This is an easy one, though, and it's a more uplifting one, because we can't end it on death, OK? In the late 60s, three days of music, and chaos are winding down. The crowd went from 400,000 people, of which they report only 200,000 of them actually bought tickets, down to 30,000 survivors still hanging on.
Dave Cravotta
Later Steve! See you dude. Yep. One more.
Reed
It's over anyways.
Jason Ziolo
The sun is coming up, it's Monday morning. An artist walks out, takes a song that everyone in the crowd knew by heart and had heard billions of times. Destroys it, rebuilds it on the electric guitar. Feedback, whammy bar, controlled chaos. It sounds less like a version of the song and more like bombs dropping, helicopters and screaming. The Vietnam War rendered in guitar noise. One of the most politically charged moments in rock history.
And God, do we need something like that right now. What song and who was it?
Reed
Hendrix.
Hendrix, the anthem, yeah.
Dave Cravotta
Star spangled banner.
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Jason Ziolo
The National Anthem by Jimi Hendrix. I
guess he was supposed to play on Saturday night and they didn't fit him in. And so everyone left on Sunday and there was a small crowd left. I didn't know this. And he walked out and he's like, fuck this, it ain't over yet. I got a statement to make. And for three minutes and 46 seconds, we've all heard it a bunch of times, he just wailed on that guitar.
Reed
He's so cool.
Dave Cravotta
Mm-hmm.
Reed
so cool. Way too early to die, man. That guy just brought so much to rock and roll.
Jason Ziolo
And what most people don't know is he played it, they've documented that that was at least his 28th time playing it that way. So this was not something that he just did for Woodstock. This had been part of his routine, but this is what made it famous. That's pretty cool.
Dave Cravotta
100%.
really?
I didn't know that. I thought I'd
Reed
don't know, it's kinda cool.
Dave Cravotta
also heard that it was Hendrix's playing that a journalist coined the term heavy metal off of his playing. I don't know if it that performance, but I thought it was because of Hendrix. Sounded like heavy metal falling from the sky. That's what I heard.
Jason Ziolo
Yeah.
Reed
Interesting. That opened the door for Goir.
Parker
That was interesting.
Jason Ziolo
Well,
that's, excuse me while I kiss the sky. Excuse me while I kiss the sky. That's Jimi Hendrix was in the paratrooper corps, I guess in the army or probably the army, some military service. And that's what they used to scream as they jumped out of the plane.
Reed
Hey funny thing, as a kid I always thought that line was excuse me while I kiss this guy.
Dave Cravotta
right yep the whole bunch of those do a cast about that there's a bathroom on the right
Jason Ziolo
Hahaha!
Parker
Yeah.
Reed
Frog Enclosure by Chevelle is always my favorite.
Jason Ziolo
Yeah.
Parker
dude looks like a lady.
there is.
Dave Cravotta
Go on.
Jason Ziolo
That's
who I am, Parker.
Reed
was, know, dude looks like a lady.
Parker
There's
something there, I don't know, I'm a little drunk.
Jason Ziolo
That was amazing, thank you for that. Guys,
Dave Cravotta
think that's it. That's our finisher right there.
Reed
Yay!
Jason Ziolo
and
there we are. We have wrapped up our Sunday night podcast. Thank you all for coming. I very much appreciate it. We snuck in this secret episode, so we're actually talking to Akaya in two days with AJ and JT, and we got our buddy Matt coming, and it's gonna be a party next Wednesday, so we'll see you guys there. Can't wait to talk more, thanks for tuning in. Later.